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Re: Jobo atl3

From: dickburk@ix.netcom.com (Richard Knoppow)



"Darkroom User" <Darkroom.User.6a97369@photobanter.com>
wrote in message
news:Darkroom.User.6a97369@photobanter.com...

David Nebenzahl;886934 Wrote:


IanG;886420 Wrote:
-
PYROCAT HD GIVES FINER GRAIN, BETTER SHARPNESS AND MORE
TONALITY THAN
D76, ALTHOUGH ORIGINALLY DESIGNED FOR LF NEGATIVES IT'S
ALSO USED FOR
35MM &120 NEGATIVES.-

If it gives finer grain as well as better sharpness than
D76, then
it must be good.

[/I][/COLOR]

IT ALSO GIVES WORLD PEACE AND FREE BEER.  YOU CAN BE SURE
IT IS
EXCELLENT.[/I][/COLOR]

My sentiments toward pyro as well. Not worth messing
with, unless one is

part of the more-exotic-than-thou brigade.


-- I am new to the darkroom and my questions concerning
pyro are genuine. I
had read on various sites about pyro developers including
WD2D, PMK and
Pyrocat-HD. If these developers offer no advantage over
standards like
D76, ID11 or XTol, then I will choose one of those
instead.

Please help me to learn, rather than post replies that
come across as
being sarcastic.
I really do want to try to understand what is good
darkroom practice,
such as choosing the right processes and materials. I have
many
questions that I want to post here on photobanter.




--
Darkroom User

     I think it is always interesting to experiment and
learn. There is a definite effect of highlight compression
when using a staining developer with variable contrast
printing materials. Its quite measureable but may not be
worth doing or may not be desirable for all images.
     The newer pyro formulas, like PMK are attempts to
overcome some of the faults of the classical formulas,
mostly that they tended to be grainy and somewhat
unpredictable. The grain comes mainly from being active,
most of these formulas use sodium carbonate or some
equivalent as accelerators. They were necessary for the
films which were contemporary with the developer. they work
with newer films, especially when diluted more than the
original instructions indicate.
    Formulas like the late ABC Pyro as published by Kodak,
Ansco, and others, is fairly long lived in stock solutions
and has relatively constant activity. Kodak D-7 is a
Pyro-Metol formula with somewhat longer life in a tank or
tray than ABC. There are a lot of variations. In my list are
some special formulas including Kodak's version intended to
maximize the stain image.
    Note that some users of PMK or Rolo Pyro suggest an
after-bath in the developer to maximize the stain. What that
does is to produce an overall stain, which is _not_
desirable rather than the imagewise stain which is what you
want. A properly developed pyro negative should have little
or no stain in the clear portions but a noticable yellow,
greenish, or brownish stain following the image. The tanning
is visible as a relief image on the dry film when held so
that light reflects from the emulsion surface. Tanning
developers were highly developed for use in producing the
relief images used in the Kodak Dye Transfer process and
Flexichrome process, each of which made use of the tanning
to make parts of the emulsion more resistant to being
removed by hot water. When "developed" by rinsing in the
water the remaining emulsion followed the iamge exactly and
could be used for absorbing dyes either for direct use
(Flexichrome) or for transfer to a support paper in a
process similar to lithography. An earlier version of the
dye transfer process, called the Eastman Wash-Off Relief
process used a different method of differential hardening,
namely a bichromate process similar to that used for
Carbon/Carbro. If you are interested in these old processes
do a Google search for "alternative processes". Most are
still practiced and can produce beatiful results. However, I
suggest for someone starting out to make life simpler by
using well-established packaged materials. Once you get
control of the overall process of development and printing
you can try experimenting with mix your own chemistry. Most
of it is not difficult to do. There are NO magic developers
but some have definite personalities which can make them
interesting. Pyro is of historical importance, it was the
first organic reducing agent to be discovered. I would not
discourage anyone from trying it out but work with something
more modern first. At this time probably the closest thing
to an "optimum" developer is Kodak Xtol. Next choice is
D-76, which is close to optimum for nearly anything and is
perfectly reliable.
     After having used a lot of print developers I have gone
back to plain old Dektol. The published formula D-72 is
about the same stuff. Ilford makes an equivalent. Ilford
Bromophen is a Dektol type developer that uses Phenidone in
place of Metol. It is better for you if you are sensitive to
Metol, which some people are and tends to give more neutral
colored images with some materials. It is perfectly
satisfactory. There are about a zillion print developer
formulas that go to show simply how imprecise one can be in
formulating:-) There is not much difference from one to
another. As far as warm vs cold tone, that is mostly a
property of the emulsion. While it is influenced by the
developer its mainly established by the paper. Developers
can have some influence on toning but that is often related
to the amount of bromide in them or other variations that
can be had by varying around a standard formula.
    One of the biggest differences between B&W and color
photography is the lack of standardization in B&W. Color
processing is very tighly specified and controlled and,
while some variation is possible, the range of variation
within which satisfactory Coloring Pictures">color can be obtained are fairly
limited.


--
Richard Knoppow
Los Angeles, CA, USA
dickburk@ix.netcom.com




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